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War Simulation [message #58066]

Sat, 26 June 2010 23:09

constantinecs
Messages: 5
Registered: June 2010
Location: Athens, Greece

FIRST PARAGRAPH NOT PART OF IDEA STATED IN TITLE PLEASE READ STILL

Ok, I will be honest with you. I am a complete, total 100% unadulterated noob at modding, from what I believe. I know enough about finding items and everything because I have used various programs like Visual Basic (to create simple applications) and CheatEngine (to modify certain values on the internet). So if you could in any way help me don't assume I am a COMPLETE idiot. Just assume I don't know what I am doing.

Ok, going to my idea now. Is it even remotely possible to have a custom quest set up so that you enter an area and two factions are fighting against each other and the quest is for you to help one faction win a battle against another faction?

I have read about people spawning armies of 50+ bandits and raiding towns. But is it possible to have spawn 50+ guards on one side of...lets say... Greatwood Entrance and have them fight 50+ spawned bandits? Or if the game cannot handle 100+ people on the screen, can I spawn smaller numbers?

I just want to know if this idea is plausable, because from what I have read on the forums so far, it is.

-Nothing makes you feel more like a man than a Ford ThunderCougerFalconBird-

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Re: War Simulation [message #58067 is a reply to message #58066]

Sat, 26 June 2010 23:33

JohnDoe
Messages: 3007
Registered: October 2007

Retired

constantinecs wrote on Sun, 27 June 2010 01:09

Ok, going to my idea now. Is it even remotely possible to have a custom quest...

Stop. No, that is not possible.

constantinecs wrote on Sun, 27 June 2010 01:09

I have read about people spawning armies of 50+ bandits and raiding towns. But is it possible to have spawn 50+ guards on one side of...lets say... Greatwood Entrance and have them fight 50+ spawned bandits? Or if the game cannot handle 100+ people on the screen, can I spawn smaller numbers?

Sure, but you'll also want to edit their seeing and hearing radius so that even on opposite sides of the largest maps, they'll be able to detect each other and purse a fight.

Look for links in the CREATURE entries for CPerceivedThingDef, CCreatureDef, CCreatureStatsDef, BRAIN... I think that's it. If you see anything else there that is named such that it might have something you'll want to edit, investigate. Everything that you'll need to edit will be labeled.

Some further editing might also be needed to get them interested in charging their targets rather than simply not giving a damn because of how far apart they are.

For this, you'll want to look in COMBAT_SEQUENCE (or is it COMBAT_STYLE... or COMBAT_TYPE... not sure) and BRAIN.

Once your edits are done, just spawn however many you want where ever you want (but do try to get them somewhere where there is navdata) and see what happens. You may also want to edit what weapons they have and how much health they have to help with any balance issues.

[Updated on: Sat, 26 June 2010 23:35]

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Re: War Simulation [message #58068 is a reply to message #58067]

Sat, 26 June 2010 23:48

constantinecs
Messages: 5
Registered: June 2010
Location: Athens, Greece

Ok, I will look into it.

But before I start, can I give my allies a path to walk/run themselves to so they actually perceive the threat and to in turn make them give a damn about there being an army of enemies waiting to fight them?

And concerning NavData....
from the posts I have read recently this particular thing confuses me. I understand that without FreeRoam even you as the PC are unable to travel in filler areas. As for NPCs they are able to operate as they normally would, yet not walk because of the lack of NavData. But my particular question is, say a spawn a flat area up in the air, spawn my NPC allies and enemies up there. If that area is capable of being walked on in the main game where ever it was, could the NPCs walk on it despite the lack of NavData on the filler map, or do no items have NavData of their own and it is only found on areas where you are able to walk in the first place?

-Nothing makes you feel more like a man than a Ford ThunderCougerFalconBird-

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Re: War Simulation [message #58069 is a reply to message #58068]

Sun, 27 June 2010 00:02

JohnDoe
Messages: 3007
Registered: October 2007

Retired

constantinecs wrote on Sun, 27 June 2010 01:48

But before I start, can I give my allies a path to walk/run themselves to so they actually perceive the threat and to in turn make them give a damn about there being an army of enemies waiting to fight them?

Only the path already given them in the default game. Where ever there is navdata, they can walk. Anywhere without it, they won't budge. The only exception is TwinBlade, but I've applied this exception to other NPCs and the result wasn't as hoped. What ended up happening was the enemies would charge directly towards me and ignore the allies... and the allies would charge directly towards me and ignore the enemies.

constantinecs wrote on Sun, 27 June 2010 01:48

And concerning NavData....
from the posts I have read recently this particular thing confuses me. I understand that without FreeRoam even you as the PC are unable to travel in filler areas. As for NPCs they are able to operate as they normally would, yet not walk because of the lack of NavData. But my particular question is, say a spawn a flat area up in the air, spawn my NPC allies and enemies up there. If that area is capable of being walked on in the main game where ever it was, could the NPCs walk on it despite the lack of NavData on the filler map, or do no items have NavData of their own and it is only found on areas where you are able to walk in the first place?

No. The navdata doesn't operate on a third dimension except in special places like buildings with a second floor (pubs, bordello, guild, a few houses, bridge in Oakvale). Even that is done in such a way that it wouldn't work in three dimensions, more like two dimensions (X,Y) on two different Z planes.

So, if the platforms in the sky were made over an area that has navdata, they'll be able to walk on it. Otherwise, they'll not wander more than a few inches from the spot you spawned them at.

The navdata is written right into the LEVs (level files), and while it can be edited with AlbionExplorer or ChocolateBox, the results are more than a tad buggy at best. Until we have exact specs on the navdata and a specialized tool for editing navdata, I'll go ahead and say that a layman probably shouldn't mess with it.

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Re: War Simulation [message #58072 is a reply to message #58069]

Sun, 27 June 2010 00:12

constantinecs
Messages: 5
Registered: June 2010
Location: Athens, Greece

Ok, I will do as the expert tells me.

So as a finality, spawn allies and enemies on an area with NavData.
(Any Suggestions)

Make it so my allies do infact see the enemy army by increasing their senses.

And last but not least, you said that the only path that whatever allies I am spawning have is the default in game path. Is that said path restricted to the unique area they are in (i.e. Knothole Glade Guard's Walking path)? Or is it just like: A guard walks forward and from wherever he spawns he will walk forward?

Or could I bypass trying to understand paths and walking areas by having them follow me until they pervieve a threat and then attack it? Effectively making me like a general of guards or something?

-Nothing makes you feel more like a man than a Ford ThunderCougerFalconBird-

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Re: War Simulation [message #58074 is a reply to message #58072]

Sun, 27 June 2010 00:25

JohnDoe
Messages: 3007
Registered: October 2007

Retired

Heh, the path will be unique to each map. Guards patrol on TrackNodes placed in the TNG scripts, but they are still restricted to the navdata. Bodyguards and anyone else who follows the Hero will also be limited within the navdata.

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Re: War Simulation [message #58091 is a reply to message #58074]

Sun, 27 June 2010 13:13

constantinecs
Messages: 5
Registered: June 2010
Location: Athens, Greece

Okay, I see what you are saying. Now, I don't want to have to tinker with the paths that the guards have scripted. So instead can I have another NPC type reskinned to look like what ever ally I want and have them follow me with whatever weapon I give them? And just have the ememies spawn and do whatever.

-Nothing makes you feel more like a man than a Ford ThunderCougerFalconBird-

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Re: War Simulation [message #58096 is a reply to message #58091]

Sun, 27 June 2010 17:35

asmcint
Messages: 1360
Registered: April 2010
Location: Behind the beef

Moderator

Yes you can do this. I recommend using a reskinned bodyguard with no fee for this one. (There should be a value that deals with bodyguard prices.) To do the weapon, just find the bodyguard you want in CREATURES, double click on it, and next to CREATURE in the little white tree thingy, click the plus. scroll down till you see weapon 1. Click that and then type in the object number of the weapon you want him to use in the box that will appear at the side. Keep in mind that NPCs cannot wield heavy weapons, so if you give him say, a greatsword, he'll just drop it. Free sword for you, but the guy will have no weapon. =/

Read the site rules, as well as individual thread rules, stickies and announcements, and use search, or you will have smartassy or exasperated ownage rained down upon you by the site's crack team of mods and admins. Also, you can find all you need to get started on modding here.

[Updated on: Sun, 27 June 2010 17:36]

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